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Has Anybody seen this?


CJMajesty

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Personally I am digging it.  Still waiting for a R/W/ B version for the 8th gen though.

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3 hours ago, deltaboxii said:

Personally I am digging it.  Still waiting for a R/W/ B version for the 8th gen though.

 

There's always the vinyl wrap approach.

 

 

59 minutes ago, CandyRedRC46 said:

Man that sure is a shiny right side up fork. That would have been really cool in 1996.

 

Damnit, yeah, that'll cost ya' at least a second and a half in a bench race!

 

:wheel:

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7 hours ago, whiteknuckles said:

No, but now that I have, somehow my VFR seems lacking.  Thanks a lot for ruining my day!:wink:

Sorry bro. But your not the only one. I noticed a button on the top of the side intake above the upper fairing. I wonder what it's for. The pipe has changed which doesn't matter because I've got a Arrow slip on, but usually when Honda changes a pipe on a bike that means they gave it a few extra ponies. 

And it looks cool in silver but I prefer the my victory red. I'm just afraid they added something to make it better. 

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37 minutes ago, CJMajesty said:

I noticed a button on the top of the side intake above the upper fairing. I wonder what it's for.

 Looks more like an access door or something. Maybe the power outlet?

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16 hours ago, Rectaltronics said:

 

Damnit, yeah, that'll cost ya' at least a second and a half in a bench race!

 

:wheel:

 

No one buys this bike to race it, but when you buy a brand new bike in 2017, you expect it to have a suspension that competes with other bikes in its class (ducati super sport, ninja 1000 etc...) in 2017, not 1995. This is a disappointment that has been dragging out since the 2006 mid generation refresh that didn't get the same attention to detail as its little brother (the cbr600) received (USD forks, weight reductions and mosfet rr etc). USD forks are not just for bench racing, USD forks benefit from much lower unsprung weight (plusher rider, better mid corner bump compliance), stiffer construction and much better/modern aesthetics as well. At least Honda managed to sneak some proper radial brakes on there without the bean counters catching it (though there still was no power increase or fully adjustable suspension), but at this rate, we'll have to wait another 10 years or so for a modern suspension, that will probably again be outdated in 2027 and still not be fully adjustable.

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Saving grace - right side up forks don't suck to rebuild... and they can be tuned to work very well, so combined with the updated brakes I'd actually prefer owning those for the long term.

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4 hours ago, CandyRedRC46 said:

 

No one buys this bike to race it, but when you buy a brand new bike in 2017, you expect it to have a suspension that competes with other bikes in its class (ducati super sport, ninja 1000 etc...) in 2017, not 1995. This is a disappointment that has been dragging out since the 2006 mid generation refresh that didn't get the same attention to detail as its little brother (the cbr600) received (USD forks, weight reductions and mosfet rr etc). USD forks are not just for bench racing, USD forks benefit from much lower unsprung weight (plusher rider, better mid corner bump compliance), stiffer construction and much better/modern aesthetics as well. At least Honda managed to sneak some proper radial brakes on there without the bean counters catching it (though there still was no power increase or fully adjustable suspension), but at this rate, we'll have to wait another 10 years or so for a modern suspension, that will probably again be outdated in 2027 and still not be fully adjustable.

 

RWU forks are far easier to work on and like USD can be tuned.  Think if a seal was going to let go I would rather it on conventional forks.   Its a tourer not a sports bike.

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2 minutes ago, fink said:

 

RWU forks are far easier to work on and like USD can be tuned.  Think if a seal was going to let go I would rather it on conventional forks.   Its a tourer not a sports bike.


I have rebuilt my USD R1 forks. It was not that bad. You are right though, when a seal lets go on a USD fork, it makes a big mess, real quick.

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10 hours ago, CandyRedRC46 said:

No one buys this bike to race it, but when you buy a brand new bike in 2017, you expect it to have a suspension that competes with other bikes in its class (ducati super sport, ninja 1000 etc...) in 2017, not 1995. This is a disappointment that has been dragging out since the 2006 mid generation refresh that didn't get the same attention to detail as its little brother (the cbr600) received (USD forks, weight reductions and mosfet rr etc). USD forks are not just for bench racing, USD forks benefit from much lower unsprung weight (plusher rider, better mid corner bump compliance), stiffer construction and much better/modern aesthetics as well. At least Honda managed to sneak some proper radial brakes on there without the bean counters catching it (though there still was no power increase or fully adjustable suspension), but at this rate, we'll have to wait another 10 years or so for a modern suspension, that will probably again be outdated in 2027 and still not be fully adjustable.

 

When you use the term "competes", are we talking about competing for looks or performance?  I noticed you had to include aesthetics...  ;-)

 

Yes, it would have been nice to have both compression and rebound damping adjustments up front.  Honda seems to have saved that for the CBR.  That has the capability to offer far more improvement in ride quality than inverting the forks.

 

Although...  I'm from the school that if you're that concerned and/or ride that hard, you should send all your suspension bits off to the likes of DMR and get them all tailored for your weight and riding needs instead of for the needs of some 132-pound Japanese test rider.  And that goes for most bikes.  Then they can add rebound adjustability while they're at it for not a lot of money.

 

Or at the very least, change the springs as appropriate.  Show of hands - who has changed out their springs for their weight?  Front and back?

 

The USD forks still seem like more of a bench racing win to me.  There seems to be a consensus that most folks on public roads would not see a tangible benefit.  Some insist that the only reason to have it on road bikes at all is for racing homoligation.  You do get some unsprung weight reduction.  ("much lower"?  how much exactly?).  Then again Honda did save some weight on the new VFR's rims, which is rotating mass, never mind this unsprung talk.  Then with your USD fork unsprung weight reduction comes an impacted turning radius, a possibly heavier overall assembly weight, greater exposure to the elements, greater liability in the case of a seal failure, and usually more difficult maintenance.

 

Plus, the 1980s called and they want their frame design goals back.  Yes, the stiffer is better thing is great for male genitalia but in the last decade or two, engineers have come to realize that all that stiffness can cause as many problems as it solves.  Now the white coats have been carefully designing flexibility into hyperbikes instead of out of them, and mid-corner bump compliance actually benefits at least as much from fork flex (thanks RSU) as it does from less stiction (thanks USD).

 

It is also worth pointing out here that reducing compliance in the forks has the potential to force design changes in the frame in order to prevent undesirable behavior (oscillations, etc.).  So it's not like someone can just say "f*** it, just re-do the triples and go for it.

 

I think a lot of folks would get more compliance changes out of tire choice.

 

"Modern suspension."  LOL.  Sorry.  Newer is not always better.  But the 8th Gen does use cartridges.  Does that help?

 

In return for the power not being particularly improved, we got a tangible boost in fuel economy.  I've seen more than a 15% improvement over my old 4th Gens, personally, and that bike gave me better fuel economy than any of the injected VFRs that followed it.  I love that.  Sorry if it does not fit your desires.

 

As for the mention of a MOSFET R/R, Honda gave the new VFR a completely redesigned and more efficient charging system that puts less stress on any R/R, and gave it new electrics all around with far better waterproofing.  Did the CBR get that??

 

 

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The 8 gen wheel weighs 6 oz more on the rear than the 6 gen. Not that I care looks better so I am running it.

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All that was missing from previous gens' forks was rebound adjustment, the 8th gen now has this. Problem solved.

 

Whether the springs are sprung to suit your weight is always going to be a problem, unless you fall into the default weight range for said bike.

 

Stiff as a surf board makes for a harsh ride, not plush.

 

The adage goes something like; "as soft as possible, as hard as necessary".

 

 

 

 

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When you use the term "competes", are we talking about competing for looks or performance?  I noticed you had to include aesthetics...  ;-)
 
Yes, it would have been nice to have both compression and rebound damping adjustments up front.  Honda seems to have saved that for the CBR.  That has the capability to offer far more improvement in ride quality than inverting the forks.
 
Although...  I'm from the school that if you're that concerned and/or ride that hard, you should send all your suspension bits off to the likes of DMR and get them all tailored for your weight and riding needs instead of for the needs of some 132-pound Japanese test rider.  And that goes for most bikes.  Then they can add rebound adjustability while they're at it for not a lot of money.
 
Or at the very least, change the springs as appropriate.  Show of hands - who has changed out their springs for their weight?  Front and back?
 
The USD forks still seem like more of a bench racing win to me.  There seems to be a consensus that most folks on public roads would not see a tangible benefit.  Some insist that the only reason to have it on road bikes at all is for racing homoligation.  You do get some unsprung weight reduction.  ("much lower"?  how much exactly?).  Then again Honda did save some weight on the new VFR's rims, which is rotating mass, never mind this unsprung talk.  Then with your USD fork unsprung weight reduction comes an impacted turning radius, a possibly heavier overall assembly weight, greater exposure to the elements, greater liability in the case of a seal failure, and usually more difficult maintenance.
 
Plus, the 1980s called and they want their frame design goals back.  Yes, the stiffer is better thing is great for male genitalia but in the last decade or two, engineers have come to realize that all that stiffness can cause as many problems as it solves.  Now the white coats have been carefully designing flexibility into hyperbikes instead of out of them, and mid-corner bump compliance actually benefits at least as much from fork flex (thanks RSU) as it does from less stiction (thanks USD).
 
It is also worth pointing out here that reducing compliance in the forks has the potential to force design changes in the frame in order to prevent undesirable behavior (oscillations, etc.).  So it's not like someone can just say "f*** it, just re-do the triples and go for it.
 
I think a lot of folks would get more compliance changes out of tire choice.
 
"Modern suspension."  LOL.  Sorry.  Newer is not always better.  But the 8th Gen does use cartridges.  Does that help?
 
In return for the power not being particularly improved, we got a tangible boost in fuel economy.  I've seen more than a 15% improvement over my old 4th Gens, personally, and that bike gave me better fuel economy than any of the injected VFRs that followed it.  I love that.  Sorry if it does not fit your desires.
 
As for the mention of a MOSFET R/R, Honda gave the new VFR a completely redesigned and more efficient charging system that puts less stress on any R/R, and gave it new electrics all around with far better waterproofing.  Did the CBR get that??
 
 



I said it competes for comfort, performance and aesthetics. When buying a brand new bike I would say that they are all very important. Of course you narrowed it down to only one quality to try and poke holes in my argument. It seems you are dead set on justifying why Honda cheaped out on the suspension, to justify your purchase, which is fine.

By showing hands, yes I have upgraded my suspension front and back. I have upgraded to USD up front. Like I said, it's not that hard to maintain. Like 3dcycle stated, Honda did not save any weight on the rims. Also I weighed the front ends back to back and the R1 and Vfr forks/brakes weighed the same, with the R1 front wheel being considerably lighter. The turning radius wasn't effected. Also with a proper front fender, you are not at any higher risk of fork seal failure.

Yes, too much stiffness is bad, but the VFR is nowhere near approaching those levels, with or without USD forks.

Yes it is just that easy as staying eff it and redoing the triples and installing USD forks. There are no issues with oscillations or anything. It works very very well.

As for the eighth gens fuel economy, yes I agree with you, the reports are great. Higher compression ratio and softer cam and port tuning will do that. I'll take your word for it that Honda finally got around to fitting a modern charging system on the vfr, it's about time. Which rr did it get? Fh020?

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Why buy the bike then moan about it? Either you have bought the bike that was most suited to you, or you bought the bike you most wanted for a particular reason or reasons, or you bought the wrong bike.

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On 1-2-2017 at 1:15 AM, whiteknuckles said:

No, but now that I have, somehow my VFR seems lacking.  Thanks a lot for ruining my day!:wink:

Get the new Honda Riding assist package and take your dog VFR for a walk  in the park.

 

 

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Why buy the bike then moan about it? Either you have bought the bike that was most suited to you, or you bought the bike you most wanted for a particular reason or reasons, or you bought the wrong bike.


I'm not moaning about a bike I bought, I love my bike lol. I bought it for the v4. It had a budget suspension, so I upgraded it. It was underpowered and heavy, so I upgraded it. Just wish Honda would do the same lol. Until then, I'll just stick with mine.

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10 hours ago, CandyRedRC46 said:

I said it competes for comfort, performance and aesthetics. When buying a brand new bike I would say that they are all very important. Of course you narrowed it down to only one quality to try and poke holes in my argument. It seems you are dead set on justifying why Honda cheaped out on the suspension, to justify your purchase, which is fine.

By showing hands, yes I have upgraded my suspension front and back. I have upgraded to USD up front. Like I said, it's not that hard to maintain. Like 3dcycle stated, Honda did not save any weight on the rims. Also I weighed the front ends back to back and the R1 and Vfr forks/brakes weighed the same, with the R1 front wheel being considerably lighter. The turning radius wasn't effected. Also with a proper front fender, you are not at any higher risk of fork seal failure.

Yes, too much stiffness is bad, but the VFR is nowhere near approaching those levels, with or without USD forks.

Yes it is just that easy as staying eff it and redoing the triples and installing USD forks. There are no issues with oscillations or anything. It works very very well.

As for the eighth gens fuel economy, yes I agree with you, the reports are great. Higher compression ratio and softer cam and port tuning will do that. I'll take your word for it that Honda finally got around to fitting a modern charging system on the vfr, it's about time. Which rr did it get? Fh020?

 

 

 

Glad it worked for you.  Others have had varying experiences.  Whenever you start moving points of stiffness and compliance, the effects are not predictable.  Even changing the brand/model of tires can have consequences.

 

The charging system on the 8th gen has been discussed in this forum.  It is completely redesigned and goes way beyond simply fitting a more robust R/R.  I wish I could dig up a good technical article on this for you but basically there's a feedback line going back from the R/R and the system adjusts how much output from each stator phase goes into the R/R in the first place, according to load, so that the stator causes no more drag on the motor than necessary and stays cooler, and the R/R does not have to cook itself in the process of disposing of huge amounts of excess energy from the stator.

That plus the new weatherproof connectors should relieve a great deal of the usual historical VFR electrical woes.

 

 

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