Which Power Commander? PCIII or PCV?

[Loftust]

As part of my hybird restoration (5th gen engine into 6th gen chassis with 6th gen ECU), I need to fit a Power Commander to dial out the VTEC behaviour etc. This has been done successfully in the UK with just the standard maps, although when I fit a different exhaust, I intend to get a custom map sorted.

 

My question is do I really need a PCV for the VTEC, or will a PC3 suffice?

[VFROZ]

I'm not sure you will be able to use a 6th gen ECU on a 5th gen motor.

All the fuel/ignition mapping will revolve around the VTEC, going from 2 valves to 4 valves.

They also have a different firing order.

A 5th gen ECU with PCIII would be much simpler.

[CandyRedRC46]

You know Rapid Bike Racing has fuel and ignition mapping, just saying :)

I have not heard that the fifth and sixth gen engines have different firing order before. That's a new one.

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[Alaskan]

Are you asking whether a PCIII will "dial out the VTEC behaviour" in a 6th Gen engine? The answer is absolutely it will. That's what I am using with a custom map. If you want to see the dyno charts, let me know and I'll PM you.

[SEBSPEED]

7 hours ago, Loftust said:

This has been done successfully in the UK with just the standard maps, although when I fit a different exhaust, I intend to get a custom map sorted.

 

My question is do I really need a PCV for the VTEC, or will a PC3 suffice?

 

A PC3 will work just fine.

[SEBSPEED]

5 hours ago, CandyRedRC46 said:

You know Rapid Bike Racing has fuel and ignition mapping, just saying :)

I have not heard that the fifth and sixth gen engines have different firing order before. That's a new one.

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I'm beginning to think we need to charge you a monthly fee for all the advertising you do here!

[CandyRedRC46]

3 minutes ago, SEBSPEED said:

 

I'm beginning to think we need to charge you a monthly fee for all the advertising you do here!

 

 

Haha me? Never 

[Dutchy]

A famous quote over here is:

 

 

An 1980's TV commercial for a toilet cleaner (called water closet duck) had a punch line that said "We from WC Duck advise you to use WC Duck".

Now synonymous for "would a chef say his food tastes awful?"

 

I assume you mean well candy, but with your sign line, it does look a bit biased. Look, for you will have the dyno chart to prove your point. No offense meant.

 

[thtanner]

If you are fitting a 5th gen engine into a 6th gen chassis, there is no VTEC. The motor simply does not have it, so you don't need to do anything. You'll just need to use a 5th gen ECU.

[Skids]

1 hour ago, thtanner said:

If you are fitting a 5th gen engine into a 6th gen chassis, there is no VTEC. The motor simply does not have it, so you don't need to do anything. You'll just need to use a 5th gen ECU.

 

That's a really, really good point!

 

 

[Loftust]

Thanks for the timely feedback guys - your support is much appreciated.

 

The Fi ECU versus VTEC ECU is a moot point - I think I'm correct in saying that the Fi ECU would require the Fi harness to work correctly - this would require separate plugs and coils from the Fi, as opposed to the VTEC's coil-on-plugs, which is another factor to consider. A loom change may require other modifications; perhaps to the various light connections - I'm not sure.

 

An ECU change would also require a HISS change, unless I went for a pre-HISS model, which could complicate insurance matters. When I decided whether to take the plunge and retain the VTEC ECU or, I recognised that both options had its pros and cons - I've pretty much committed myself to retaining the VTEC ECU now, and fitting a PC to adjust the fuelling accordingly, especially as it's likely that I'll fit a different set of cans at a later date.

 

Both options probably cost about the same, given the additional parts that need to be purchased/fabricated. 

 

I don't think the firing order is different - if it is, something is awry with the bikes that have already had this conversion carried out...

 

I suppose my question should have been 'does a PCIII work with a VTEC ECU?' The feedback thus far suggests that it will, so that's what I'm going to order. Thanks again folks :)

 

 

[thtanner]

Let us know how it goes. To me fitting the 5th gen engine has traditionally been done by fitting the 5th gen ecu/loom. Honda is allergic to change so maybe all the sensor connectors/etc are all the same. 

 

Edit: I really don't see how this is going to work by slapping a PC3 on in hopes to fully disable VTEC via a tune. The PC3 only does fuel mapping changes, not VTEC engagement. I don't think you can say "don't turn on the extra valves here".

[Loftust]

9 hours ago, CandyRedRC46 said:

You know Rapid Bike Racing has fuel and ignition mapping, just saying :)

I have not heard that the fifth and sixth gen engines have different firing order before. That's a new one.

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I just Googled Rapid Racing, and got this:

 

http://www.rapid-racing.co.uk/

 

[thtanner]

It's http://rapidbike.us/

[CandyRedRC46]

17 minutes ago, Loftust said:

 

I just Googled Rapid Racing, and got this:

 

http://www.rapid-racing.co.uk/

 

 

Lol or you could just click the link in my signature.

 

This will help if you're doing some research.

http://www.dimsport.it/en/rapidbike/racing/

[Loftust]

1 minute ago, CandyRedRC46 said:

 

Lol or you could just click the link in my signature.

 

You're right, but I don't like to make life too easy for myself  

[VFROZ]

17 hours ago, CandyRedRC46 said:

You know Rapid Bike Racing has fuel and ignition mapping, just saying :)

I have not heard that the fifth and sixth gen engines have different firing order before. That's a new one.

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Sorry, what I meant to say was that they number the cylinders differently, but I could just be having a blond moment.

[CandyRedRC46]

Well that shouldn't be a big deal.

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[JZH]

Are you aware of Mark (from IoM) on the Bikersoracle site?  He did the 5th gen into 6th gen swap several years ago and started a thread about it.  No need to re-invent the cam gear, so to speak...

 

Ciao,

[Loftust]

I am thanks - he passed me his number just before Christmas - I've been working so doggedly on the bike and returning to work, I've yet to get back to him! I'm pretty much following his approach - if you can't trust a pilot, who can you trust? ;-)